Comments on: Shame on WSJ For Not Asking What Nielsen Is Smoking http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/ Marketing blog focused on marketing optimization, improving website conversion rates, search engine marketing, web analytics, word of mouth, etc. Sun, 22 Nov 2009 07:37:43 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: ClickTale Blog » Nielsen NetRatings Confirms: Pageviews are Dead, Long Live ActiveTime™ http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-1145420 ClickTale Blog » Nielsen NetRatings Confirms: Pageviews are Dead, Long Live ActiveTime™ Sun, 22 Feb 2009 23:35:30 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-1145420 [...] for which a page was open on a user’s computer. Though an improvement over the older system, ‘total minutes’ does not take in to account the coffee and bathroom breaks of it’s.... How often have you dropped whatever you were doing on line to go scavenging for food, or to run to [...] [...] for which a page was open on a user’s computer. Though an improvement over the older system, ‘total minutes’ does not take in to account the coffee and bathroom breaks of it’s…. How often have you dropped whatever you were doing on line to go scavenging for food, or to run to [...]

]]> By: Tal Schwartz http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-105555 Tal Schwartz Fri, 13 Jul 2007 21:43:09 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-105555 I totally agree with your point: “spend some time looking at the ways in which people actually engage with the Web”. That’s why ClickTale records and plays back movies of visitor interaction. In addition, we invented a new statistic called ActiveTime™ that counts the time a user has spent interacting with a webpage, rather than just the amount of time a page has been left open. Read more in our blog post: http://blog.clicktale.com/2007/07/11/nielsen-netratings-confirms-pageviews-are-dead-long-live-activetime/ I totally agree with your point: “spend some time looking at the ways in which people actually engage with the Web”. That’s why ClickTale records and plays back movies of visitor interaction.

In addition, we invented a new statistic called ActiveTime™ that counts the time a user has spent interacting with a webpage, rather than just the amount of time a page has been left open. Read more in our blog post: http://blog.clicktale.com/2007/07/11/nielsen-netratings-confirms-pageviews-are-dead-long-live-activetime/

]]> By: Page Views Stink, But "Time Spent"? Ha!! http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-102320 Page Views Stink, But "Time Spent"? Ha!! Tue, 10 Jul 2007 12:56:01 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-102320 [...] is this announcement one of the worst-kept secrets since Sir Elton John's orientation–we laughed when The Wall Street Journal reported the move to "time spent" back in April–it's like firing a mummy and replacing him with a zombie to track your [...] [...] is this announcement one of the worst-kept secrets since Sir Elton John's orientation–we laughed when The Wall Street Journal reported the move to "time spent" back in April–it's like firing a mummy and replacing him with a zombie to track your [...]

]]> By: Mark http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-44173 Mark Sat, 05 May 2007 01:53:33 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-44173 What are Nielson smoking? I want some of that, it must be good stuff. Seriously, are their customers THAT stuck in the TV age? What are Nielson smoking? I want some of that, it must be good stuff.
Seriously, are their customers THAT stuck in the TV age?

]]> By: Chris Heuer’s Idea Engine » links for 2007-04-22 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-38078 Chris Heuer’s Idea Engine » links for 2007-04-22 Mon, 23 Apr 2007 09:25:58 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-38078 [...] Time Spent: Nielson Moves From Away From Page Views Good point on shifting from page views to time spent as key engagement metric - their are flaws in all approaches, but we still need to measure what we can (tags: socialmedianow socialmedia engagement measurement nielsen video) [...] [...] Time Spent: Nielson Moves From Away From Page Views Good point on shifting from page views to time spent as key engagement metric – their are flaws in all approaches, but we still need to measure what we can (tags: socialmedianow socialmedia engagement measurement nielsen video) [...]

]]> By: Robert Gorell http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-38031 Robert Gorell Mon, 23 Apr 2007 06:22:06 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-38031 Ian: It's not about the page views being cheated, it's about the fact that Neilsen/NetRatings is replacing one meaningless in-a-vacuum metric with another meaningless, and grossly misleading, pseudo-metric: 'time spent.' We recently published <a href="http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/02/21/web-20-metrics-the-more-things-change/" rel="nofollow">another piece on the subject</a>. Ian: It’s not about the page views being cheated, it’s about the fact that Neilsen/NetRatings is replacing one meaningless in-a-vacuum metric with another meaningless, and grossly misleading, pseudo-metric: ‘time spent.’

We recently published another piece on the subject.

]]> By: IAn http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-38020 IAn Mon, 23 Apr 2007 06:02:52 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-38020 I'm not hearing that they WON'T measure page views. I'm hearing that they won't rank sites by page views. That seems very reasonable. We all know page views are essentially useless in terms of measuring success because they can be skewed by design, refresh rates, etc. I’m not hearing that they WON’T measure page views. I’m hearing that they won’t rank sites by page views. That seems very reasonable. We all know page views are essentially useless in terms of measuring success because they can be skewed by design, refresh rates, etc.

]]> By: Ramon Ray http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-37934 Ramon Ray Mon, 23 Apr 2007 00:19:20 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-37934 Brian, thanks for adding sanity to the conversation and for blasting these idiot companies out of the water. Ramon Ray, Smallbiztechnology.com Brian, thanks for adding sanity to the conversation and for blasting these idiot companies out of the water.

Ramon Ray, Smallbiztechnology.com

]]> By: Rolf http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-37803 Rolf Sun, 22 Apr 2007 14:18:16 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-37803 I agree Bryan, but would it be possible to track both the time spent metrics and page-view metrics and draw out something of both together? Instead of using one or another only. I agree Bryan, but would it be possible to track both the time spent metrics and page-view metrics and draw out something of both together? Instead of using one or another only.

]]> By: PlusOne - Musings of a marketer » Time Spent: An alternative to Page Views http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-37796 PlusOne - Musings of a marketer » Time Spent: An alternative to Page Views Sun, 22 Apr 2007 12:54:55 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-37796 [...] was interested to read this at Time Spent: Nielson Moves From Away From Page Views The Wall Street Journal’s (account required) reporters are top-notch journalists. Journalists [...] [...] was interested to read this at Time Spent: Nielson Moves From Away From Page Views The Wall Street Journal’s (account required) reporters are top-notch journalists. Journalists [...]

]]> By: Alison Byrne Fields http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-37610 Alison Byrne Fields Sun, 22 Apr 2007 01:59:34 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-37610 Yes, Bryan, because we all know that it matters what the user does while the browser is opened. Do they leave a comment? Participate in a poll? Feel compelled to write a post on their blog in response to the content? Leave behind their contact information? Join a membership program? Participate in co-creation? BUY something? Yes, Bryan, because we all know that it matters what the user does while the browser is opened. Do they leave a comment? Participate in a poll? Feel compelled to write a post on their blog in response to the content? Leave behind their contact information? Join a membership program? Participate in co-creation? BUY something?

]]> By: links for 2007-04-22 « David Black http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-37252 links for 2007-04-22 « David Black Sat, 21 Apr 2007 14:31:32 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-37252 [...] Shame on WSJ For Not Asking What Nielsen Is Smoking - GrokDotCom On the introduction of time per visit metrics, touted as a replacement for page views: visit duration is inflated by distractions from the site; ignores tabbed browing; and is only indirectly linked to engagement. (tags: internet audience measurement trends nielsen) [...] [...] Shame on WSJ For Not Asking What Nielsen Is Smoking – GrokDotCom On the introduction of time per visit metrics, touted as a replacement for page views: visit duration is inflated by distractions from the site; ignores tabbed browing; and is only indirectly linked to engagement. (tags: internet audience measurement trends nielsen) [...]

]]> By: D.VDA http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-36667 D.VDA Fri, 20 Apr 2007 11:00:07 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-36667 Ouf, someone finally asks the questions ! And I use to add this one "Why 30 minutes ? Because of the Webalizer default parameters ?" Page view, Visitor, unique visitor, and now Time spent. Why not talking again about hits and kilobytes ? ;) Ouf, someone finally asks the questions ! And I use to add this one “Why 30 minutes ? Because of the Webalizer default parameters ?”

Page view, Visitor, unique visitor, and now Time spent. Why not talking again about hits and kilobytes ?

;)

]]> By: Biznology http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-36440 Biznology Fri, 20 Apr 2007 04:52:23 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-36440 <strong>Do We Want to Measure Time Spent?...</strong> Andy Beal and Bryan Eisenberg are both asking good questions about the new "time spent" metrics that Neilsen/Netratings is introducing. Andy wants to know how time spent is calculated (good question) while Bryan assumes that it is time spent in...... Do We Want to Measure Time Spent?…

Andy Beal and Bryan Eisenberg are both asking good questions about the new “time spent” metrics that Neilsen/Netratings is introducing. Andy wants to know how time spent is calculated (good question) while Bryan assumes that it is time spent in……

]]> By: Stephen http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-36387 Stephen Fri, 20 Apr 2007 02:43:27 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-36387 I agree with you and think that they should use some combination of metrics to measure value. I agree with you and think that they should use some combination of metrics to measure value.

]]> By: Ben http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-35994 Ben Thu, 19 Apr 2007 12:51:34 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-35994 This is just as bad as comScore's recent press release trying to convince everyone that panel measurement is better than web analytics. This is just as bad as comScore’s recent press release trying to convince everyone that panel measurement is better than web analytics.

]]> By: Jestep http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-35976 Jestep Thu, 19 Apr 2007 12:30:19 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-35976 Normally I have 7 or 8 at once, and I highly doubt that the erratic browsing seen with multiple tab using users would be an accurate measure of user behavior, especially more accurate than simple page views. Normally I have 7 or 8 at once, and I highly doubt that the erratic browsing seen with multiple tab using users would be an accurate measure of user behavior, especially more accurate than simple page views.

]]> By: David L http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-35943 David L Thu, 19 Apr 2007 11:27:49 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-35943 Crap! Thirty minutes trying to write something, and I've got nothing. Crap! Thirty minutes trying to write something, and I’ve got nothing.

]]> By: Marketing Pilgrim http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-35908 Marketing Pilgrim Thu, 19 Apr 2007 10:45:34 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-35908 <strong>Can We Measure Visitor Attention?...</strong> Last month, comScore changed from measuring page views to their new “visits” metric, designed to better measure visitor engagement. Or, as they put it, “visits” measures “the number of times a unique person accesses conte... Can We Measure Visitor Attention?…

Last month, comScore changed from measuring page views to their new “visits” metric, designed to better measure visitor engagement. Or, as they put it, “visits” measures “the number of times a unique person accesses conte…

]]> By: Brian Thibault http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-35825 Brian Thibault Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:09:50 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-35825 Bryan, I agree with you that time spent can be hard to track. I think its also becoming hard to track page views though because of the increasing amount of web 2.0 interactive stuff (flash, ajax). All the clicks within these interactive pages can't be counted by analytics programs which severally skews page views. Bryan,

I agree with you that time spent can be hard to track. I think its also becoming hard to track page views though because of the increasing amount of web 2.0 interactive stuff (flash, ajax). All the clicks within these interactive pages can’t be counted by analytics programs which severally skews page views.

]]> By: Andrew Goodman http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-35702 Andrew Goodman Thu, 19 Apr 2007 05:29:02 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-35702 Ha, great post Bryan. Ha, great post Bryan.

]]> By: Anil Batra http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/comment-page-1/#comment-35626 Anil Batra Thu, 19 Apr 2007 04:02:44 +0000 http://www.grokdotcom.com/2007/04/19/shame-on-wsj-for-not-asking-what-nielsen-is-smoking/#comment-35626 Bryan, I completely agree with you, I wanted to point you to an article that I wrote on Why I don't like time spent on site as a KPI. http://webanalysis.blogspot.com/2007/01/understanding-time-spent-on-site.html Bryan,

I completely agree with you, I wanted to point you to an article that I wrote on Why I don’t like time spent on site as a KPI.

http://webanalysis.blogspot.com/2007/01/understanding-time-spent-on-site.html

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